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Chris Rosebrough (@PirateChristian) on December 16, 2007 in Emerging Movement | Permalink
There you have it. If anyone wants to know what the emerging/emergent church movement is about, this video shines more light and the video clips are condemning. All I heard was me, mine, I, we, us, together, experience, dissatisfied, change, shift, post modern, post Protestant (that's a fact), and on and on. And PBS knows who the ringleaders are, Doug Pagitt, Brian McLaren and Tony Jones. They cannot deny their culpability in this all-out assault on orthodox, Biblical Christianity, nor do I think they would. I became sick to my stomach when I saw the almost occultish practice of the labyrinth and the votive candles. It's such a man-centered, man-worship "experience." Who is this for? Well, it's for the individual. Yep, that's it.
I heard a wonderful message in church today about what the coming of Jesus means to a world filled with depraved, unrighteous, pathetic sinners like me. When Jesus declares He is the WAY...it means HE IS THE WAY! Not some walk around a rat maze on the floor, or lighting a bunch of tealights then babbling like the pagans. Except for some of they way they are responding to the poor and disenfranchised, these emergents have it WRONG, and they're so blinded by their egos and deception that they don't or won't even see it. So sad and shame on them for their role in all of this.
December 16, 2007 at 10:59 PM
Egad, what is that relationship arrangement at about 6:56 in the video? Was that a Mormon-flavored Emerging service?
Michael A. Vickers |
December 17, 2007 at 12:25 PM
It's one thing to reach out to young people in this day and age who might not be comfortable in a traditional church setting. Don't want to sit in pews? Fine. Want to sit on couches? Fine. Want to have your church in a living room? Fine. Want to sit on the floor with a cup of Starbucks? Fine. But if you are going to call yourself a "church", there has to be someone to lead that group in the truth of what the Scripture says, and you have to believe that the Bible says what it means and means what it says. And if you are going to have a leader, then, as Titus 1:9 says, that leader "...must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those who contradict it."
Of course, maybe this is why they don't want any type of "hierarchy", so that they have no accountability. At least they can think they have no accountability. But as we all know, God will severely judge those who purport to teach His word, but do so wrongly, and pervert it, and cause others to do so.
Besides, if you don't believe you can trust the Bible as perfect, then "trying to follow Jesus' example" will be impossible, because if you say one part of the Bible isn't true, then how can you say ANY of it is? And if you can't believe what is written about Jesus, how can you "follow His example?"
December 17, 2007 at 12:52 PM
Yep this is the interview and part 2 also -- there are also some extras on the website here:
part 1 (check the links in the inset pictures for extra video that wasn't in the original)
there are further interviews here:
Religion and Ethics Newsweekly - Week 845
Religion and Ethics Newsweekly - Week 846
Very very telling. Hearing it from the horse's mouth, long before I ever read anything by Ken Silva or much on the emergent church at all, PBS taught me that these people are heretical.
December 17, 2007 at 08:23 PM
Michael Vickers exclaimed:
>Egad, what is that relationship arrangement at about 6:56 in the
>video? Was that a Mormon-flavored Emerging service?
Seriously...I hadn't caught that the first time through! (nor the second, third... etc.. I've seen it many times!)
But that seems to be Solomon's Porch in the Twin Cities of MN.
Doug Pagitt -- courtesy of Wooddale church (where he previously served as youth pastor) and the Evangelical Covenant denomination (www.covchurch.org - also, "coincidentally," the denomination affiliated with Scot McKnight and North Park University and Seminary) which allowed Solomon's porch to affiliate with it and whatever perks they got for belonging to the Covenant.
December 17, 2007 at 08:30 PM
I would urge moderation in our condemnation of the emerging church/emergent church/emerging church movement, etc. I am reminded of 2 Tim. 2.25, where Paul urges Timothy to "(correct) his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth." The bottom line, I think, is that they claim to be seeking Christ. Christ comes to us in His Word and Sacrament. We should be pointing our "opponents" here - to the Word and Sacraments - with gentleness. As C.F.W. Walther essentially said of the Lutheran Church - Missouri Synod, the only thing that keeps us together is the Word of God and the power of persuasion. It's a difficult generation to be a Christian - not that it's ever been easy (and we're not being fed to lions at the moment). This "movement" asks a lot of important questions (I've read some of the books of McLaren, McKnight, Carson, Pagitt and Tony Jones). Before we attack people we should continue to work to answer these same questions from Scripture - teach and reproach gently, but with a sense of urgency, of course. The stakes are high. So, for now, I am a "sympathetic observer" (to use the words of the video) of this "movement." It pains me to hear of any of God's sheep being fed poisonous food . . . . Peace to you this Christmas season.
December 19, 2007 at 10:44 AM
what questions do you believe we need to work to answer from Scripture that are currently being asked by this movement?
December 19, 2007 at 04:21 PM
It's all about them and it's not about Christ, that's what I see in this video. These people don't even know Him. They are looking to please themselves by making a God that they like, rather than finding the truth.
December 19, 2007 at 04:37 PM
The clip seemed to imply/indicate that this is primarily a middle-class white movement. Does anyone have any idea if that's the case?
If so, could this be another expression or symptom of the ennui of a Church (or at least a portion of the Church) that has not seen hardcore persecution?
Heidi Sue |
December 19, 2007 at 05:46 PM
So it's all about asking questions and having "dialog"? OK - I'm fine with that, but what if I attended one of these "dialog" sessions, and in response to some of the questions, I proposed some answers from God's word, answers that are objective, answers that are not just based on my own personal "experience".
Would my inputs be welcome?
December 19, 2007 at 08:58 PM
Thanks for posting this!
It was good to see Don Carson in the video. I found his book “Becoming Conversant with the Emerging Church: Understanding a Movement and Its Implications” to be a balanced and forthright treatment. For something a little more colorful and bombastic, I would recommend “The Truth War: Fighting for Certainty in an Age of Deception” by John MacArthur.
I was discouraged a little yesterday when I went to a discount bookstore and found a shelf full of each of these books. These stores usually do not carry a book until it’s sales are waning, and these books are fairly recent. It seems the old-fashioned truth is less popular than the innovative nonsense.
J. K. Jones |
December 24, 2007 at 12:33 AM
Kim u said what appear to be the issue here "It's all about them and it's not about Christ, that's what I see in this video. These people don't even know Him. They are looking to please themselves by making a God that they like, rather than finding the truth.
Posted by: Kim | December 19, 2007 at 01:37 PM"
Just another deception to cause further division in the kingdom. There are some things we do because that are just customs and something are well, not so much just a practice - fine u wanna sit in a circle, u wanna do all those those things good but for the grace that God has poured out in our lives stop letting it be so much about you and how u want to and u feel - Jesus (ya the one who we are supposed to be imitating) was always concerned not about Himself but about pleasing God. at this rate we'll have a generation in the next 20 or so years that completely thinks that the whole premise of the bible and truth is a subjective thing - that is so scary.
Father, we hold true to your word psa 119:9 that we can only be cleansed from all sin and deception when we pay attention to your word. Hide your words in our hearts God so we might not sin against you and God let your love be seen in us more than anything, then we'll be doing what pleases you.
February 15, 2008 at 05:44 PM
Theology is messy? Our God is a God of honor and order. It is we the sinners who are messsy. These people seem very concerned with leading people to their churches and not at all concerned with leading them to Christ.
December 04, 2008 at 07:56 PM
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