Hey “Pastor” Warren Have You Seen This?

Rick Warren, could you please explain to us how getting Christians and Muslims to work on your Global PEACE Plan will convince Islam to not conquer the World and impose Sharia on the entire World?

Here is a video of an Islamic leader in the UK explaining their objective for the UK and the world. What is their "clear objective"? Answer: DOMINATION of ISLAM.

Note this video is NOT a "Christian Mischaracterization of Islam" this is a Muslim teacher in the UK explaining the clear objective of Islam and the four ways that they could achieve that objective.

Here's a "Bonus" video of another Islamist. See if you can "feel the love" coming from this follower of the "Religion of Peace" then ask yourself, if this is the man you'd like to work side by side with while "conquering the global giant of spiritual emptiness".

Comments

[Mike]

I agree that Warren's efforts to work side by side with Muslims is misguided. From all I can see, it's simple humanism.

However, using these examples of extreme Islam isn't really speaking to the point. It leaves open the fact that there are many Islam groups that aren't (prima facie) like this. At worst it looks like mischaracterization, hyperbole, and trickery.

It'd be far better to use scripture to illustrate that it's a)wrong and b)won't work.

Using examples like these are distracting.

[Becky]

Chris,
Thanks. You are right.

I'm not assuming anything any more.... especially that these are extreme, distracting examples of an ideology most of us don't even know much about. (Though I have been trying to get informed about Islam at the jihadwatch site as well as others... for "balance.")

Have you seen this? Rick Warren is going along quite happily with point number 3.

from atlasshrugs blog
A refugee from the Muslim Middle East thinks he has discovered Islam's 20-point plan for conquering the United States by 2020
Anis Shorrosh, author of ''Islam Revealed'' and ''The True Furqan,'' is a Christian Arab-American who emigrated from Arab-controlled Jerusalem in January 1967.

''The following is my analysis of Islamic invasion of America, the agenda of Islamists and visible methods to take over America by the year 2020,'' Shorrosh says. ''Will Americans continue to sleep through this invasion as they did when we were attacked on 9/11?''

1. Terminate America's freedom of speech by replacing it with statewide and nationwide hate-crime bills.

2. Wage a war of words using black leaders like Louis Farrakhan, Rev. Jesse Jackson and other visible religious personalities who promote Islam as the religion of African-Americans while insisting Christianity is for whites only. What they fail to tell African-Americans is that it was Arab Muslims who captured them and sold them as slaves. In fact, the Arabic word for black and slave is the same, ''Abed.''

3. Engage the American public in dialogues, discussions, debates in colleges, universities, public libraries, radio, TV, churches and mosques on the virtues of Islam. Proclaim how it is historically another religion like Judaism and Christianity with the same monotheistic faith.

4. Nominate Muslim sympathizers to political office to bring about favorable legislation toward Islam and support potential sympathizers by block voting.

5. Take control of as much of Hollywood, the press, TV, radio and the Internet as possible by buying the related corportations or a controlling stock.

6. Yield to the fear of the imminent shut-off of the lifeblood of America – black gold. America’s economy depends on oil and 41 percent of it comes from the Middle East.

7. Yell ''foul, out-of-context, personal interpretation, hate crime, Zionist, un- American, inaccurate interpretation of the Quran'' anytime Islam is criticized or the Quran is analyzed in the public arena.

8. Encourage Muslims to penetrate the White House, specifically with Islamists who can articulate a marvelous and peaceful picture of Islam. Acquire government positions and get membership in local school boards. Train Muslims a medical doctors to dominate the medical field, research and pharmaceutical l companies (Ever notice how numerous Muslim doctors in America are, when their countries need them more desperately than America?) Take over the computer industry. Establish Middle Eastern restaurants throughout the U.S. to connect planners of Islamization in a discreet way.

9. Accelerate Islamic demographic growth via:

•Massive immigration (100,000 annually since 1961).

•Use no birth control whatsoever – every baby of Muslim parents is automatically a Muslim and cannot choose another religion later.

•Muslim men must marry American women and Islamize them (10,000 annually). Then divorce them and remarry every five years – since one can't legally marry four at one time. This is a legal solution in America.

•Convert angry, alienated black inmates and turn them into militants (so far 2,000 released inmates have joined al-Qaida worldwide). Only a few ''sleeper cells'' have been captured in Afghanistan and on American soil.
10. Reading, writing, arithmetic and research through the American educational system, mosques and student centers (now 1,500) should be sprinkled with dislike of Jews, evangelical Christians and democracy. There are currently 300 exclusively Muslim schools in the U.S. which teach loyalty to the Quran, not the U.S. Constitution. In January of 2002, Saudi Arabia’s Embassy in Washington mailed 4,500 packets of the Quran and videos promoting Islam to America's high schools – free of charge. Saudi Arabia would not allow the U.S. to reciprocate.

11. Provide very sizeable monetary Muslim grants to colleges and universities in America to establish ''Centers for Islamic studies'' with Muslim directors to promote Islam in higher-education institutions.

12. Let the entire world know through propaganda, speeches, seminars, local and national media that terrorists have hijacked Islam, when in truth, Islam hijacked the terrorists.

13. Appeal to the historically compassionate and sensitive Americans for sympathy and tolerance towards Muslims in America who are portrayed as mainly immigrants from oppressed countries.

14. Nullify America's sense of security by manipulating the intelligence community with misinformation. Periodically terrorize Americans with reports of impending attacks on bridges, tunnels, water supplies, airports, apartment buildings and malls.

15. Form riots and demonstrations in the prison system demanding Islamic Sharia as the way of life, not America's justice system.

16. Open numerous charities throughout the U.S., but use the funds to support Islamic terrorism with American dollars.

17. Raise interest in Islam on America's campuses by insisting freshman take at least one course on Islam.

18. Unify the numerous Muslim lobbies in Washington, mosques, Islamic student centers, educational organizations, magazines and papers by Internet and an annual convention to coordinate plans, propagate the faith and engender news in the media.

19. Send intimidating messages and messengers

to the outspoken individuals who are critical of Islam and seek to eliminate them by hook or crook.

20. Applaud Muslims as loyal citizens of the U.S. by spotlighting their voting record as the highest percentage of all minority and ethic groups in America.

You can have a fuller read at http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2009/07/islamic-invasion-of-america-the-20-point-plan.html

[Chris Rosebrough]

Mike,

Could you please tell me what happens to Christian street preachers and open air evangelists in Saudi Arabia (the very center of the Islamic world), Iran, Pakistan and Egypt?

What happens in those countries to a person who converts from Islam to Christianity?

[Mike]

Hey Chris, yes...I know. I'm very familiar with the geopolitical goals of Islam.

However, I've also worked/managed many Muslims in my workplace...and they are not like the videos at all. Most people with any direct experience with Muslims will say the same....many/most of them *are* peaceful people who want to raise families, etc, even though the false religion they follow will eventually lead to destruction for them and others around them.

Thus, you will immediately lose credibility with anyone who doesn't already believe you.

Your blog is entitled Extreme Theology, so I submit that *that* is what you should use to detail the problems with Christians yoking up with Muslims for peace, love and happiness.

Using the extreme angles of Islam will not make the point we all need to make about this topic.

[Chris Rosebrough]

Mike,

I didn't ask you about your experience with Muslims in your workplace.

Your contention is that the men featured in these videos are fringe Muslims and their views are not in keeping with the mainstream teachings of Islam.

Again I ask you. Could you please tell me what happens to Christian street preachers and open air evangelists in Saudi Arabia (the very center of the Islamic world), Iran, Pakistan and Egypt?

What happens in those countries to a person who converts from Islam to Christianity?

When you answer those questions you'll have a far more realistic idea about what mainstream Islam is all about.

[Ray]

Mike,

"However, I've also worked/managed many Muslims in my workplace"

I believe there are a billion muslims currently (more or less) in the world with the vast majority of them being OUTSIDE of the United States.

How many have you worked with/managed? 10? 20? 100? Does your experience with so very very few realistically offer up valid, objective evidence that THEY are the ones that are "the norm"? If I met 100 super-nice, ultra-peaceful muslims, I would still have to say, if I was being objectively honest, that the chances the 100 out of 1,000,000,000 that I met are the EXCEPTION is infinitely more likely than that they are the norm.

Let's say, for that sake of argument, that that are 100 million muslims in the U.S.(I don't believe the number is that high, but I could be wrong). Even if I met ALL 100 MILLION of them and they were all super-nice & ultra-peaceful, that would only be 10% of the total global muslim population and the odds that those I met are the EXCEPTION is still more likely than them being the norm. And if the other 90% are the exact opposite, then the exact opposite of "super-nice" and "ultra-peaceful" IS THE NORM. And that's assuming that all of them - as humans, not necessarily muslims - are being absolutely honest about what they truly believe and that they truly do believe in peace, equality, etc.

What's the point? Subjectivity is irrelevant. It is the shifting sand, and we are fools if we build our house upon it.

Let's turn this on Christianity: It's doesn't matter if 90% of Christianity teaches something, it's not TRUE Chrisitianity if it is in opposition to the objective, God-given Truth of Scripture. In other words, God's Word determines the Truth, NOT Christians.

Likewise, what determines whether Islam is a so-called "religion of peace" is what the Koran teaches. Because muslims, like Christians, may or may not believe or act according to what is really taught. Therefore, the marauding, murderous "Crusader" is not a true representation of Christianity though he may "act in it's name"; nor may the "friendly muslim" coworker be a true representation of Islam eventhough he or she claims to be devout.

-Ray

[Mike]

I stipulated to your point. Yes, in all those countries Christians are persecuted--to the point of death. Further, I indicated that the ultimate geopolitical goal of Islam is to make all locations like those countries.

Yes, yes...I know. The Muslims are out to get us. Just like various groups have been since the beginning of time.

But, your use of the term mainstream is not relevant to your point unless you are speaking to someone who lives in one of those countries. Mainly because "mainstream" will not be associated by most people with "the center of the Muslim world".

Mainstream to most people are the experiences and groups in their own countries. Attempting to change this is not effective.

The reason my explanation of workplace is relevant is because it is much closer to what most people's definition of "mainstream" is. You can define it in the Middle East all you want. But you're playing into their hand with this because the Muslim teachings are about gradual assimilation and take-over.

With all due respect, stick to Theology and the Gospel. There's power there. There is no power in rhetorical attempts to demonize--perceived or otherwise.

[Danny Gardner]

Wow, I am naive. I didn't know there were christians like Mike. Perhaps Pope Warren feels that since he doesn't place much emphasis on scripture's commands that no one else does, including those whose scripture's are from the Koran.

[Dauidr]

Hey, Chris!

Great comments! Rick Warren is deceived both in regard to his own faith and in regard to that of Muslims. After all, the radical Muslims don't think much of their supposedly peace-loving kinsmen. It's popular here in the West for folks to reinvent Islam into society's own image just as they similarly think they can reimagine Christianity.

The version which Rick Warren sees of Islam is a liberal version which does not even take its own writings seriously. If they did, they would not spiritualize their own surahs 41 and 43, etc.

As is, our gracious Lord has given us the message of salvation that truly brings conquest over death because of Jesus' death for us on the cross. In Him there is no compromise or blending of culturally conditioned amalgamations. Christ says to liberal and radical Muslim, "Repent, and trust in the Gospel." Likewise, He issues the same call to Rick Warren. He kills us each day in our sin to raise us up in His gift of new life because of our Baptism. Now, that good news worth contending for.\

[Chris Rosebrough]

Mike,

1. Current Islamic nations give us a perfect picture of what Islam is all about and what is at the center of that religion. Islam is not interesest in working with Christians on Rick Warren's "Global PEACE Plan" for the "common good". That is just simply naive and wishful thinking on Warren's part.

2. The Gospel is what Warren should be focusing on instead and telling other Christians to focus on instead. I preach, teach and defend the Gospel every day on my radio program (literally). My critic of Warren's efforts are prompted by a firm belief that his efforts distract Christians away from calling their Muslim neighbors to repentance and the forgiveness of sins in Jesus name.

[John C]

We get so bogged down in the things of this world, what we see going on but how do we rise above it? If we continue to identify solely with our human ancestry, nationality, etc we will be sorely "grounded" in this world of which Christ said we are in but not of (John Ch 17, not a specific verse but the only summary, conclusion of His words). We think (and therefore we are until our minds be renewed in the truth) that we are John Doe of 1000 Main St. USA, etc but truthfully if we are in Christ our true (and liberating) identity is NOW (Eph 2:6) of a spiritual nature and we are no longer mere natural men and women but new creation's in Christ Jesus. We are "born of God" (Jn 1:13) who is Spirit for that which is of the flesh is flesh, that which is of the spirit is spirit.

We dont love and worship a historical (physical) Christ but a risen Lord who indwells His people even NOW being joined to them spirit to spirit (1 Cor 6:17). This One IS our life (Col 3:4)would now live His life through us, even as us (Gal 2:20). We speak much of Christ's dying for us, but too little is known of His living through us and the death of our old man (adam) Romans 6:6-8. This is not mere allegory (our death w/Christ on the cross) but literal and liberating.

A regenerate and renewed man is a stranger here, his citizenship is not of this world, knows he is not from here, but has a heavenly (meaning spiritual) origin, and is therefore not attached to the temporal confines of his adamic lineage. The renewed man identifies with his spiritual ancestry which is his true origin and end. This way he owns nothing and neither can he himself be owned.

This is the danger of an “American” Gospel, the precious blood of Christ is red, not red, white and blue. Truth always leads to greater measures of freedom, may the Lord show us our true homeland which is of a heavenly (spiritual) origin and may we live separated unto God as "strangers and aliens" during our sojourning here. We are (Christ in us is) a light in this dark world.

Will we forsake all (our old identity, nationalism, who we think we are, etc) so that we can (finally) be who He says we really are...not of this world?

We need a revelation of Christ IN us, the mystery of the ages (Col 1:27). All the best.

[Lygia]

Britain has been asleep for too long.I believe that it is too late to reverse the horror of Islam in this land I live. They are very clear about their intents and all the British people does is to look the other way and pretend nothing is happening.Rick Warren is doing a horrendous disservice by trying to disseminate the idea that Muslims are people you can work with.Is Rick Warren blind? And what about having some spiritual discernment about Allah?Who is he? Not the God of the Bible he isn't, he hate Jews and Christians and has no Son. Who is he, Rick Warren, any ideas?